Human in the White Coat


people, black, happening, medicine, patients, journey, movement, microaggressions, white coat, trauma, sherry, doctor, hear, conversation, community, hair, students, big, pandemic, GABA


Candice Blacknall, MD, MBA

Magdala Chery, MD

Candice Blacknall 00:06

As you all know, these motivation Monday conversations are all about normalizing the human experience along the journey to medicine. And, you know, forgive the technical difficulties but this is all born out of the movement that GABA currently has to make everyone aware that you don't have to be perfect. And you don't have to be this cookie cutter person in order for you to be able to be successful in the career to medicine. So hopefully having these conversations with folks that have done it will inspire you so excited for our Gary who's done amazing things, both in medicine and outside of medicine around racial equity, particularly, and Hello, you're here. We're here. Hold on, let me just fix my screen. Okay. Let me let me like, set some stuff up here. Okay, I feel like we both are we good? Yeah. We made it. How are you today? I'm good. How are you? Oh, it's so good. I'm so glad that you're here. And after. It's such an amazing talk yesterday. It's great. Oh my god, it was so great. I'm so y'all don't know this. But Dr. Sherry is taking over the world one conversation at a time. And I'm going to not even try to explain all the magnificent things that she's done. And give her the floor to really give a little bit about her background. And then roll right into that credec awesome question, which is what was your journey to medicine like? So let's do this. Hi, everybody. My name is Dr. magma sharing. Most of my friends know me as Maggie or mag or Dr. Sherry or whatever. Egg mag make it happen. Um, but I'm a board certified internist, I practice internal medicine in the primary care setting. And I was actually in academia for three years after residency, I'm a proud do so I went to the do Smith school in New Jersey. I had gotten my Masters before that. And then I went to UConn for internal medicine with a distinction in primary care, because I always knew I wanted to do primary care. And then following that, I went to the academic space. Did that for three years. We'll talk about that. But I will always say that my passion was always delivery, health care delivery, primary care, health care, delivery, how I could bring my expertise. And really just imagine primary care differently. Practice. Although I loved inspiring students, I love the academia part, I knew that I wasn't getting the thrill that I wanted in the primary care part. And I wanted to do more. I wanted to reach my patients more. So I was like, What can I get for additional training. And then I was always following the Commonwealth Fund fellowship and minority health policy, because I saw a lot of their graduates were doing some amazing stuff. Black community for Minority Health. So I applied, I'm there now. So I'm finishing up the later half of the fellowship year, which is one year at Harvard University. So that's what I'm doing now. Other things about me or what I do. I'm also the creator of the not just the black body campaign hashtag matches the black body background, it came about Addison tragedy, I lost both of my parents to the pandemic, to COVID-19. In the pandemic, my father would die first, and would die not just for COVID complications, but also from just the hospital. Now, the patients are dying, proportionately, so seeing what was happening and seeing the narrative, so everybody kept talking about black people can't get COVID it's not really real. I was like, it's very real. It's very real. You know, yeah, movement became about And specifically, as I was leaving the hospital, trying to advocate for my father, because typically with anybody goes to the hospital, I stay there. And I advocate and I'm explaining things, I noticed that they just, it was so haphazard, because it's literally like a disaster job. They're just trying to like plug things. And I specifically said to the staff, like I need you to understand he's not just a black body. He's a father, he's a grandfather. He's a preacher. He's a lot of things. He's not just a black body and value his life as such, just as we do in our community. So after that, it just really became a bigger movement than just my family's story, just a movement of we're not just black bodies, our bodies. were being manipulated, we're being abused. We're not being appreciated. And guess what, like, I'm not okay with it. So that's the movement I've joined. I've joined with Dr. Jessica, who's a community psychiatrist out of Connecticut, and Dr. Sabrina, who's in New York, who's also an internal medicine doctor and we're going to be launching some amazing stuff. So follow not just a black body on Instagram and follow the hashtag. And yeah, that's where I'm at right now just cultivating my voice. I'm being continuing my path to being authentic in medicine, and trying to inspire students and trainees along the way. Yes, I love it. I love it. Now, obviously, y'all are listening, y'all are hearing all these amazing things that she's accomplished over the course of her career. But you're also hearing like, the real human journey of having to deal with, like, being in this skin being of diverse background, family loss, and, and, and having to kind of navigate that. And I think you said a really important word, which is authenticity. So I'm wondering, like in terms of being authentic and your journey to medicine, how have you had some pushback with that authenticity? And then what was your journey to really grounding yourself in the reality of your own experience? Ooh, okay. That's a lot. So yeah, when I go natural, I go natural. And see, I've always if you know, my friends laugh, I'm the last one to go natural in the group, essentially, I will never thought that I Hello, black hair, silky Lackey, that's the only way to be fully professional. And I bought in westernized view. And this white supremacy view of professionalism. So the the going natural was the breaking point, the need to embrace being authentic was really birthed out of everything happening in our world. So I would be in med school towards the latter part of med school and in training, you know, shortly after the trademark, Trayvon Martin situation, essentially, and all the things after and then the white coats for Black Lives are birth right, as I was graduating going into residency, yeah, for this moment, where I was in the hospital, where I'm seeing the things happening on the news and the common room, but no one really discussing it today. Yeah, it was like the silent. But yeah, yeah, it was that it was going it was like having to hide into the car room to to understand, like, what was happening on TV, but then going into the hallways of the hospital, and seeing people treat you differently and look at you with a white coat on. So I remember specifically saying there's no difference between the hoodie and the white coat. all they see is black skin. So if all they're gonna see is black skin, the conforming the assimilation, the projecting of what they want to see is not working. Yeah, I feel myself, I feel like this little part of me, that's not fully me. So in that case, like, as be me. Yeah, simple, but it's also this journey of womanhood and embracing what it means to be bold, be loud, secret. We're not allowed to talk about those things. But I do want those things so I can actually make change in the community. And for me, as a person who's of Haitian descent, that's also another layer, because that's not what I'm trying to defeat what I'm talking about a professional school and this really just cultivate this authentic voice. But I think it goes down to always feeling like something was missing. It was the board's it was beyond grades. It was beyond, you know, having the right mentors, but something didn't feel right. Right. Right, as I was doing all those things without being myself. Yeah, yeah. So like, we talked a lot about on this show about how important it is to really ground yourself in like yourself, like run your own race. And I think, you know, just like you hit on the head, like, especially for people that are coming to this journey from diverse backgrounds, from the non white, non crisp, you know, linear background, like that is a factor in your ability to succeed. And so, like, I just wonder, you know, in having had that journey, and and seeing like, your diverse patients and what they go through how do you feel that you being grounded in yourself has actually impacted your ability to take care of patients and be successful as a doctor? Oh, man, so I think it's helped me tap into so you get all this training, right? You you learn a new language, I tell people, the medical terminologies and a whole new language. So language, you know, you learn a new way of comporting yourself and, and becoming this, you know, revered professional and leader. But your community doesn't recognize that right? Right. person who now she thinks she's better than everybody. She's right. Right? So then you're torn because you feel and this is something that's coming up a lot too as black doctors are taking the vaccine and this conversation about people feeling like retreaders, right. You've now had to put on this new mask and this new veil this new language so you can fit in there. Yeah. How do you bring your experiences from before med school so that's what it's been for me? This ability to just say, Okay, I got this knowledge. I'm grateful for this privilege. Now, Maggie. And I think Maggie in particular, because it's not very now happy until three inches from outside of medicine, tap into what it was like and why people respect the church. And why did you how your hair can help you in that in that you remember from your upbringing, and put that with medical terminology, yeah, at what you learn in med school. And that just gives you a whole nother level of being able to care for patients, especially in the primary care setting. So it's more than just how smart you are your board scores, but your patients don't care about that. Yeah. They haven't told me your board scores. permanence. I'm going to pick you as my doctor. Yeah. Yeah. Are you on social media? And first of all, I love that here. I said I was about it. About you at my church. I heard about you from a family friend who said they felt comfortable with you they felt safe in your office. That is what leads me right. So I think that's the part like it's not, it may not make sense now as you're going through training. But even after training, even during training, this is your the expertise in being black. Yeah. Black. I'm an expert and being a black woman, my black woman, right and my womanhood, bring that expertise to the table and combine it with medicine. Yeah, yeah. I love that. So I'm imagining when you change your hair, we're Where are you? Are you in medical school? Or were you after school? Or you're after medical school? Sorry, I don't know why I'm having to tech. But technically, today, I cannot. What was the what was the backlash? Like? I'm asking because I know that is like, it's like, when I decided to lock my hair. I remember it being not just a conversation with myself. And like what I want to do it was also like, I had to consider all these other people. Suddenly, like what I wear on my head is very political. And you know, you have to kind of fill that in. And what was the reaction? Like? Did you get any any backlash? The biggest backlash was my mother. Really? Ah, and I think we don't talk about that enough. She was like, What are you gonna do? Like, are you gonna festival anymore? Yeah, it's in there. Like, it's not good. And I actually scheduled my visit to cut my hair. So I cut it into a bob first and like, let them out. To turn. It was first the cut, she didn't even fully know that I was actually going to go completely nuts. To do this, and he came in surprising me like, Oh, I'm going to get my hair done, too. And saw like my hair being cut. And almost, and almost had a heart attack. I bet she was like, I didn't. I didn't turn around here. I was like, keep doing it. Keep keep. Um, so that was one of the big hurdles. I think at work. Because I started I did it in a way that was comfortable for me. So I tell people, as you gain your voice and an embrace your authenticity, do it at a level that makes you the most comfortable. Yeah, you don't have to prove your blackness to anyone. So want to make sure you're okay with how you approach things. So for me, it was easy to go short, I was wanting to Bob, I wanted to sneak a line Bob and see if I could rock that flag. Which was actually technically half like partially natural, but you couldn't tell that I straightened it, and then cutting it and straightening it, cutting it and train it. And so I knew most of it was was natural. And then I would transition completely to wearing my hair natural and wearing frozen twist outs and different things. So that's how I did it. I know my colleagues were like, Oh, I love your hair. When I would try different styles. They wouldn't really comment. I had braids, so it wasn't really backlash there. It was more I actually got it more from my mom initially. And slowly but surely the confidence grew. So I didn't really pay attention to it. Oh, can you hear me? I can you have such terrible technical issues? Okay. My because it's raining in Atlanta, everything goes goes crazy in Atlanta, whenever there's precipitation. What I hear in your story, and I think this is so important is this reclamation of your humanity, and you being really grounded in your own identity and taking that and using that in your in your career. And I think about that, particularly because I know a lot of people that listen to this show are here because they have at some point in their journey had someone tell them like, you know, you can't wear your hair like that and be a doctor. You can't be Oh, can you hear me? Your video keeps breaking up a little bit. Ah, come on, come on internet. But basically people get messaging all the time that they're not good enough to fit into the status quo that medicine has kind of come to represent. And so for the students that are listening, what would you say would you How would you recommend They deal with or maybe prepare themselves to deal with those kinds of voices that say they're not good enough. Can you hear me? Yes, I can. Okay. Okay. You need me to repeat it? I know some things are not good enough. Yeah. For the students that are listening, you know, having heard people say that they're not good enough for whatever reason, whether it be their hair, their skin, their background, what would you tell them to either kind of tone those voices out or to fortify themselves as they kind of go into the medical field? Yeah, so this, oh, we could talk about this. So two things have to happen. Which is what people don't understand the complexity of being black, and brown in medicine. And he's not even just medicine. He's professional spaces. A lot. You don't have anybody who before us who went before. Family right? time. So sometimes there's two things happening, sometimes it's our own personal struggles, factoring into what people perceive us. So you've gotten there. And this is like the topic of imposter syndrome. And you think that you're, you're not good enough to be there? Can you hear me? And so you feel like you're not good enough to be there. So no one has necessarily said anything to you. But you wondering when you enter this room? So people, I mean, a way to conceptualize it is, how many times have you walked into the lecture room? And you're counting on people look at you. I mean, yeah, I do. I walk it? Yeah. How many black folks? 1234. Cool, we're good. surance of actually, deserving to be there that quite often don't understand. I mean, how many white people do you think have to enter a room and count how many people are there? Like, that doesn't exist for them. So that's sometimes that's part of it. And which is why I any mentee that comes to me, we do a lot of work on their background, I want to know where you come from your culture, because a lot of times you're breaking a lot of cultural norms, just by existing in this space, you're existing. And even beyond that, a lot of us, when they come talk to me, they don't just want to be a doctor, they have all these big ideas and vision and especially for women. That's big, right? Because people just want you to make married and put some big exact put some babies and a lot of them are in this in this like, struggle internally, to not only just live out what people want from them, but also do they silence the law, the vision and the passion that exists inside of them. And that's a separate thing. And then now you start saying, am I good enough? Am I dreaming too big? Then there's a factor of Yes, people are doing implicit bias, explicit bias microaggressions and racist acts towards you, which makes you further devaluate your worth. So there's two pieces of work that needs to be done. The first part is that internal work. So we don't really celebrate that in medicine, because when you're in people think, okay, it's all about grades. No, no, no, you're going to be interacting with humans, human lives are going to be in your hands, you need to have a good sense of self. And that is the articulation to emotional intelligence, right? So you got to be aware of who you are, what you're about your own biases, your own triggers your own trauma, and how that translates. And that is oftentimes the hindrance that we have as we're in training and in that system. So that's that part. Then the second part is as those biases racist acts, microaggressions, discriminations happen, call them out a lot. They happen. And we you know, we do okay, I should expect this. We talked with your bucket, and a bucket of all that stuff happening to you, just keeps growing and growing. And everybody's, I've watched you so much. Step two is right, not just touching your hair, you have a bucket of microaggressions and racism that's building, right. So now when they touch your hair, yeah, you you're like, Yo, I'm over this like this. Right? So, right. That's the complexity of being black. And the complexity of being a black student. That happens in a student of color, I should say, because I think we share a lot of these microaggressions and trauma together that people don't understand. So when you're talking about your worth, you are there. You are worthy. I had daily affirmations for myself when I was in med school, especially when I got to third and fourth year, because now I no longer had my whole class where I could find my few black friends. Yeah, patients. I'm on these rounds and everybody's white. Or and I might do I don't look like Yeah, yeah, it's real. And I started shrinking. Even though I was a good student. I was excelling. I couldn't present I would be on rounds like I would set her nervy. Yeah, nervous and no one could see my academic capabilities for a minute because I would always like, I don't know if that's the right answer, I'm second guessing. So daily, every time I would wake up in the morning, before I left in the mirror, I would say you're worthy. You're going to be a doctor, you're worth being a doctor, you got this and speak that into myself and watch myself in the mirror as I did that, before I went to my rotations. Whoo, that's powerful. Where were you when I was going through? Because it's, it's a real thing, especially third year, you know, I remember walking in to take care of a patient on my surgical round. Most of the surgeons that are with my team, their old white guys, or even young white guys, and I was on with this, I walked in with the surgical team had a conversation with the patient. And as I was leaving the room with the surgical team, the patient goes, Oh, I'm sorry, nurse. And I'm like, No, I just said, I just said, I'm with the surgical team. I'm here, but you identified me as the only black female. I couldn't possibly be a part of the surgical team that just introduced themselves. No, I think Yeah, yeah. Better one, I call it. Third year. resident, it's me, I have an intern, a white male. And I have a white male attending really great attending. I loved working with him. We go and see a patient, this patient I've already so often residents will pre round before the team so they know what's happening, even though there will present but you're always on top of your game. So I already saw the patient. I sat down with a patient. I talked to him about his diagnosis, and what we're thinking is happening. So now we're on rounds with the attending in my team. And he's on the phone. So he's on the phone talking to his friend. The intern walks in and the intern you know, same white coat, same badge, whatever big doctor badge. Oh, all the doctors here. I might have to call you back. My attending walks in white male again. Is it Oh, another doctor? Wow, I have to call you right back. I walk in white coat badge, same thing. You know me? Yeah. And I walk in? He goes, Oh, the maid is here? No, oh, it would have taken everything in me to keep my face. He said gather. And no one corrected him. No one corrected him. See, I think. So. Afterwards, it didn't become a discussion about race, it became a discussion as Oh, it happens a lot to females. It was about race. Now it's about race, but it definitely is off because he does a lot of drinking or whatever. Actually, if you want to blame it on that, it's inhibition. That means that that is what he truly believes. Right? Right. Answer, call it whatever you want. But it is what it is. Yeah, no, we would have had to, you know, it's kind of like one thing. So naturally, I run GABA and I make a point of Saint calling it what it is. And I think people don't do that enough of calling racism and calling these systems of oppression what they are. And I definitely don't think we do that in medical education. And I think that's why we see the dropout rates and the challenges that we see with our diverse candidates is because we like to blame, or the system at least like some of these people, students have not arrived into medical school and worked as hard as they have only to prove that they're not capable, they're highly capable. But there are these social and cultural things, that medical education just doesn't address, that they have to come back. And after a time you get you get burned out, you get fatigued. And that and that and there's just there are not enough candid conversations about that reality at all. Um, and you bottle it up, right? So I do my training, but I mean, what I saw in attending hood, attending hood, which is when you're done, when some of those actions happened with white staff for me now I'm an attending. Um, I had a visceral reaction, like I was having a panic attack at one time when when when a white female ma came to me. Yeah, I remember things. Okay. I know, I'm mad about the situation. But this seems bigger than that. Yeah. Elias was like a combination of the racial trauma that had built up trauma through training that now was manifesting itself as me shaking in my office. Yeah. saying, wow. And that's what led me to eventually seek out therapy and get help, because I was just starting on the job. And I was like, I can't this can't this can't Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Like we not do that. Yeah. Not today. Oh, no, no. Yeah. No, and I think so. It's like you said, you know, it builds up you think like, these things are all in this one. microaggression here. I read a quote, a long time ago, and it was like, you know, the thing that really burns you is all the times you have to betray yourself by not speaking up. You don't get to advocate for yourself. And over time, that builds up into a level of trauma that you then have to unpack on your own. And it's like when when what's the we know, no one knows what the upper the feeling limit is on this thing. But it's there. It really is. It really is there. Right, um, other parts. And I love the fact that you talk about like, your journey to mental wellness, because I don't think that we're honest enough about mental health, particularly amongst physicians and in the medical space. Have you felt like they're much more candidates? Oh, can you hear me? Can you hear me now? how I felt about having more candid conversations, I believe. Yeah, have has it hasn't? How are we having more candid conversations within the medical profession, about mental health and about how I've been on my page, and it's one of my, one of my sincere passions to talk about. I've used my own journey of grieving. And what that became for me to share. But not we're not talking about it. I mean, that's what is that I'm extremely afraid of, I think mental health workers, healthcare workers, are going to be burnt. Yeah. And I'm really smcu it sincerely pains me to see that our country doesn't get it. Like we, I mean, let's use this pandemic. We have doctors who have literally been at this for a year, we may have went into lockdown in March, but they were seeing some shit happen, excuse me, happened in the haka or on time and couldn't really speak it because they didn't even understand what was happening because we were not getting information properly. Right. So to me, I'm like healthcare workers and frontline workers. I've been at it for a year, we didn't know what was happening. But especially in the hospitals as numbers, I remember some of my residents saying, Dr. Sherry, I'm reading up on stuff because something's happening in the hospital. It's not flu, they're not coming to poop positive, but I keep intubating people for symptoms in internal medicine. So we received that a lot. I was like, really, and I remember, distinctly my resident was like, your doctor showed us something that somebody ended up and she would be reading other stuff. I'm like, Well, tell me what you find. In January and February, and then March is when everything hits. So a year of this a year of watching people die, a year of being able to tell your family and friends what's really happening, a year of you trying to process your emotions and being away from family and now we're not gonna be okay, let alone with everybody in society. trauma and trauma. Yeah, again, financial hardship, man, if we don't make public health and an emergency in regards to mental health, we had dire problems and I home administrator. I've been tweeting it and putting it out. It needs to be on vitamin Harris's agenda. Yeah. And if you want to take it to the next level, think about what happened last week. That was trauma. Yeah. Yes. That was traumatizing for people who saw how a whole a whole group of people got treated differently? Because let's be real, if it was us, we wouldn't get away with it. Oh, yeah. Oh, no, we wouldn't even touch the ground. After capital and body bag and body bags. Oh, no, it would have been a done deal. Absolutely would have been the same way. body bags. So the fact that we are merely existing after watching that is another level and insult to our mental health. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. pappadeaux saying, you know, health care workers after this pandemic, it's gonna be like a PTSD a whole nother form of PTSD. That if in and I would even argue that it's already here. You know, we talked about physician burnout. I lived I tweeted that in my one of my posts when people were like, Oh, my gosh, we're so excited about your strength. I said. You want to know what this strength looks like? Right? Like, I can't remember things. I can't sleep, I can't hear. I can't do certain things. I'm walking around with a notebook to recall my meme. Like, dude, like, if you want to celebrate it, celebrate what all of us are going to do as we process stuff, not just agree, but what we saw. So we just have to have more people at the sound alarm. I know it's hard, because some people are worried about their licenses or standing in the academic world and things like that. But we need some honest conversations about mental health. Absolutely do that. People are starting to talk about it, but they mask it as wellness. That's just nonsense. No, that's a totally different Yeah. And and I think it's like we had like, because I'm like, that's a totally different conversation that you don't make Well, what's already sick. We Have to roll this thing back, treat the illness treat the underlying problem. And then we can talk about wellness. And I think we could all agree in the medical profession that there is a sickness amongst medical professionals. That hasn't been talked about as candidly as it needs to be. Yep. Yeah. I mean, even when it comes to just physician suicide rates, we don't hear about that. And I don't even know what that number is now. Exactly. Exactly. And I mean, for all we know, that number is even higher, higher than ever. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. When you talked about earlier, when you talked about how you were able to really ground in your sense of self and in your identity, you talked about how that really changed. It got harder as you got to third year and fourth year where you didn't have your your nest of folks that you were going to, that looks like you that understood your struggle. And I feel like that really highlights the importance of building your nest, or like I say, I tell people build your nest of people that understand in building your nest and folks where there are things in particular that you consider about, hey, these are the kind of people I need around me for this journey. Or was it kind of just like, hey, just a convenient sample? Or if you will, a building? So I call it building my tribe? Yeah. Five, that's how I term it. Yeah. And my tribe, for me, is outside of medicine. Right. So my mentees and other people, like, Who are the people who helped you get here And granted, I know, we help some people, you know, don't understand your struggle, and it's gonna be hard to have certain conversations. But I believe in creating your tribe outside of your actual one, I don't think healthcare and medicine should be in a silo. It's one of the biggest mistakes we've had that we've seen transpire in the pandemic, right. But that's one part of it. But the other part of it is, there's so much you can bring to people who can remind you who you are, when you're they're not in it with you. So my tribe has attorneys have nice paralegals has people in corporate America athletic trainers, I live and die. The success of Maggie of Dr. Sherry, is by her group chats. Because Eddie, and she will go cover people and then emails. So my tribe, on the outskirts Rumi back before somebody get hurt, not only for me back then but also provide me validation. So a lot of times when I see certain things, they're like, no, how you been about that work, they don't understand that. Let's help us, let's help you regroup, and to what your bigger mission is. Whatever that is, they reel me back in my faith. So when I start doubting they're like, but you know, your source, you know, what's important to you know, what you believe in, they will be back in with my bigger vision. So when I'm getting confused about where I'm going, they're like, No, no, remember, you always said you wanted this. You always said that. So for I tell people, not only to have that in medicine when you can, but really, outside of medicine, like I have some dope friends and all that. I know. I mean, one person I spoke to today, she she she married a friend in my intimate circle. She's a judge. I mean, and she's 30 she's in her 30s she's judging you. Right, exactly. And a Haitian woman, right? The most incredible intimate conversations about life and faith and religion, and she just got married. So we're talking about what that transition has been like for her just being this intimate circle of dialogue. She's not in medicine. Right? And not even just like, I mean, I didn't even know her growing up completely. She married one of my good friends, right? So if you can make new friends in adulthood, I know we say no new friends. Oh. Really bad habits. Yeah. Not even the people outside of your field. But think about as you elevate as you go to new places, you're gonna meet new people be okay with that be okay with answering people who not only celebrate you that and I love that you have folks outside of medicine because it's very much you get this this messaging that people aren't going to understand what you're going through. But you really do need those people that are going to remind you why you started this journey. I tell mentees, Hey, stay grounded in the why why there gonna be people left and right of you that tell you you can't do it because you got a C on this and a B on that. And you I don't know you didn't do 2 million volunteer hours. But if you stay grounded in the why and and have your your tribe like you say to remind you of that, why then that makes the journey less daunting at times. And yeah, so I I know that we talk a lot about your work surrounding racial equity and justice and the hashtag not not just a black body campaign, and I love that. For folks that are wanting to kind of get more involved learn more about that movement. How can they find you? What can we as a community do to rally around that message and keep the conversation going? Oh, absolutely. Great question. So we have an Instagram Kate page. So if people want to just stay into what's happening by direct profile on Instagram, Dr. Mengele, Sherry writing my profile, you'll see founder of not just a black body campaign, they can click on it and follow. Our website was up. But we are relaunching with some exciting stuff and the announcement of our new leadership that's joining me on this movement. So that's going to be releasing towards the end of the month, if not early next month, it's intentionally taking a minute because we want to make sure we do this right. And we want to make sure we can outline where we need help, and people can get off. So especially for med students who are looking for something different to do, but also have on their resume to speak to the work that speaks to them. We're going to have lots of opportunities to really engage. And we also want to engage people outside of medicine. That's actually one of our big agenda goals, which is why we're being intentional with the rollout. Because we don't want just doctors we want nurses doulas, people in law school people who are in politics, people who are in Social Work people who are in and, and everything is different and not being a silo. So the for now is to follow the ID page, because we keep that pretty, pretty up to date. We'll be launching the relaunch of the website too soon. And then also on Sundays at eight o'clock, I have a I host a room with the two other leaders on clubhouse. So if you have the clubhouse app, make sure you follow me on there. And then you'll be able to see when I'm having those discussions. And they're amazing. So if you don't do anything today, that is what you need to do. On your Sunday, I got lucky I got from someone. And they have like amazing, amazing wisdom about liberation and healing. And not just in medicine. But just as people, we got to start talking about this thing as a human experience and not just a medical experience, which is what Dr. Sherry is all about. Certainly what we're about at GABA about building community around this humaneness of of medicine, because that's actually where you get to heal and have an impact on your patients and actually do healing because our system is not set up for healing. Oh, no. Right. It's set up for money. Yeah, well, under that. Yeah. We've had some, okay, but that one, I had my notebook out, okay. in there, like, you know, pretty late, like near one o'clock, like actually looking up into I read the oj and Ollie Blackstock article about the Black Panther and Young Lords movement, in, in, in, in advocacy for health care. And I was like, this inspiration. I know. I was like, that's how, how moved I was from the conversation and not for me, but the information that was being dropped. And just reminding myself, I have so much more to learn, if I want to do this the right way. Because it's not this movement is not about me, this movement is about elevating the voices of those in the community, and giving them what they need and what they want, and how they articulate how they want to look, not what I am. Yeah, I'm excited. Yeah, not right. This is amazing work. It needs all hands on deck, I really do think that, you know, COVID i COVID. A terrible, but I think it forces on to Pittsfield and really reflect and pay attention to some really important issues in our country and in our healthcare system. And that that one that one is is a huge one. It's not enough to just recruit black talent to our medical programs, that we're not taking care of them. And it's not enough to just have black professionals out there if we're not empowering their voices and empowering their ability to create change, like, yep, it's like, what's real representation is representation just put me on your phone a lot in the room and asking me, asking me to please impart my knowledge and my expertise as a black person as a person who relates to the black community. And not just mine, because I'm a black woman who's the daughter of immigrant parents. But what about other black we're not a monolith. There's, there's so much to our dialogue and who we are, there's intersectionality, as well. So when we say representation, are you really about representation? It's the same conforming and I'm tired. I'm done. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Same. And that's, that's what this conversation is about. I'm so glad that you're here. I really like I, I really can't. So folks that are listening. Usually around the like the 10 minute mark, I started asking for questions from those of you are that are. back and see if I saw something. Yeah, Papaji feels like it takes a village. So glad that you have your tribe. And definitely stay away from people who drain you, you don't need that kind of energy. And you don't need that kind of energy. Like, you know, I had a student a mentoring session a couple of days ago with a student who said that, you know, she had a friend who was really negative about her journey and about her grades. And I'm like, that's not a friend. Yeah, that's fine. Is that person that's, that's not a friend, we got to get that person out of here. And I think that's really important, particularly if you are of diverse background. You see we have anything else in here. Okay, I think I read them off. Sometimes I'm scrolling so fast. And I wish you know, I'm like the old lady looking at this thing. Because the font is like and nine font and I'm like, did I have any more questions in the thing? Yeah, I'm like, let me see. Take some really self care. Question. What would you tell med students who internalize that they are not good test takers? Okay. Um, all right. There's so many levels to that. Okay. So I think the idea of not being a good test taker is a thing. But it doesn't mean you can't get better. Right? So I think it's one thing to accept that and come to the conclusion that taking test is a difficulty for you. But now we have to unpack what's the difficulty? Is it a mental thing and a mental and emotional were to the point that you just made you're internalizing that you're not good enough to do well, that's, that's something we can work through. And one, is there some test anxiety there? Do you have some bad experiences with test taking? Is there some trauma related to that, and that's going to probably take the help of a counselor and even a therapist or even psychiatry, and that's not I'm saying it out loud, because that should be accepted. their white counterparts often do that. So in it's okay to have your study skills. You may be a bad test taker for particular reasons. Maybe you study the knowledge, but you don't know how to apply it. So get help. So don't internalize a you thing, right? I can't do certain things. I can't play a certain instrument. What am I going to realize that when I pick up the piano, like I don't do that, right? Right. skill, I go ahead and learn it. It's like being in the gym. Right? I've never squatted before done a certain movement. Of course, the first time it looks horrible. But what do you do you get a trainer, you watch videos on YouTube, you it's a muscle I, there's so many things in life, whether it's your leadership skills, test, taking skills, public speaking skills, storytelling skills, whatever it may be, their muscles look at, as a muscle. If you don't use it, you lose it. If you haven't used it, often it's weaker, right? So you get practice and you do different things to exercise that muscle. So say Same thing with test taking, get practice, re evaluate and assess the situation, what is the issue, get a better sense of clarity with that get help to get you a better sense of clarity, and then exercise that muscle to do better. Yeah, I love that. I mean, because these things are not permanent states of being we hear that test taker and it feels like like that was a stamp that they put on your head at birth, every something that's in your DNA, you are forever prone to this illness. And it's really not it's just it's just the muscle that you have to flex and push that label off of yourself. Someone asked what can a regular run of the mill ordinary person do to further your cause? And I'm thinking and I'm going to add to that your cause in turn is I don't know this person is asking that but non black people allies in the black community. Are they welcome? Oh, yes, yes. Yeah. So So if we're talking about the not just the black body if further push the cause. So just to give people a background, the background is, you know, I lost my parents to COVID and we know that COVID was this grand thing that lets us see What's happening in healthcare and just to disparities amongst systems, right? So initially, we started with sharing COVID stories, which is great, but we're, we're still doing that we're going to do it in addition, these things in healthcare. This did. So now, we want to be thought leaders and solution oriented and how we start to fix those issues. So in that regard, everybody's a part of that little bit, just to realize this is this is part of the issue. And one thing I said in clubhouse yesterday and one of discussions, this movement is geared towards black people, and I need people to have that it's intentionally geared towards black people won, I'm a black woman who black people have been oppressed by our system and many levels, including in health care. Yeah, that was the story of Dr. Susan Moore, who was a black physician who died not by COVID, but also by the system and mistreatment in the system. So it's an even graver, she was a physician practice for 20 something years. So it's even a bigger example of how the system has racist, white supremacy. In it, right. So we have perfect time. So what we're going to plan in partly partially amplifying it, like use the hashtag, not just a black body, if there are stories of patients were black and brown, who have gone through the system, and they had a bat like something happened. We want to hear those stories, because that amplifies our voice and being able to talk about what needs to be done. If people have ideas of how we can partner with community organizations, because we're worth I say, we take it we're taking it to the streets, it's getting real grassroots, because we don't believe those structures are safe for people to feel vulnerable. So people have ideas on how we can partner with schools, community organization, religious institutions, to really reimagine healthcare and reimagine how it's delivered in practice, and send us a DM send us a message. And, and and soon enough, for the next month, we're going to be holding town halls for the community. So people can come in, share their experiences, share what they think can also add to the movement, and then we can partake with them how they can be involved. So for now, just continue to watch us on clubhouse, listen to what's on clubhouse, follow us on Instagram, and understand the movement is for black people. But when we take care of black people, all people will pick up on people pay. out on that word, y'all. Dr. Sherry, always an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us on this motivation Monday and sharing your story about how you were able to harness your humaneness to transform this amazing career into a powerful mission that's truly going to impact millions of lives. I hope the folks listening walk away from this conversation knowing like you matter you belong and don't, don't strip away all your color just to be able to fit into the white coat. Y'all know the coat is white, you don't necessarily have to be stay white, though that might be t shirt, Murphy, I'd be right. And add to that as a last closing message. We need you, we need you but we need you as your authentic self. I don't need you as a conformed self. I need your authentic voice and your authentic experiences. I need that that's what we need on this side. Because it's not going to be a Dr. Sherry thing. It's not going to just be a one doctor, not just a black body thing. It's going to be a collaborative effort if we're going to move the needle and all systems in this country forward, but you got to be that most authentic real in tune self. So this doesn't become about you and finding who you are. But it really becomes about others and how to move the needle folded forward using your privilege. Yeah, I love it. I love it. Y'all like follow get in contact with Dr. Sherry and the movement. For students that are listening GABA is 100% free for you if you join after listening to this conversation 100% free I can guarantee it because yeah, it's me. So, get involved, get engaged and be inspired. Y'all have an awesome week and we'll see y'all next week for the next motivation Monday. Thanks so much. I was a pleasure. Bye